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MR. VOCHO
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294 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
It's time to change my spark plugs and I don't want to pay $175 to get them changed from my local VW dealer...

Can I do this my self?

If so what tools do I need?

And what type of sparkplugs you recommend for my Turbo S?

I'm about to change my air filter w/an OEM filter too...

Thanx :D
 

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my turbo is bigger!!!!!!!
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502 Posts
i run plane ole bkr7e copper plugs....
 

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Sloooooooow Down!!!!
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899 Posts
I use the ngk bkr7e plugs -gap at .028, 1.59 a plug at advance auto parts-check the old .org you will find good pics and info on how to.

Not difficult with the right tools.

I use the k&n filter-really like it.
 

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Bourgeoisie
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309 Posts
Just remember, the cheaper copper plugs work fine, but need to be replaced more often than the stock platinums. It's still cheaper to use copper, though, even with the decreased lifespan.
 

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Keep It Real
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1,746 Posts
SIX SPEED said:
It's time to change my spark plugs and I don't want to pay $175 to get them changed from my local VW dealer...

Can I do this my self?

If so what tools do I need?

And what type of sparkplugs you recommend for my Turbo S?

I'm about to change my air filter w/an OEM filter too...

Thanx :D
I wouldn't use standard copper plugs in this engine, I would either stay with the stock plugs or go with a set of Denso Iridium or Beru plugs which are some of the best available. You can get the Denso's from World Impex or Neuspeed for about $10.50 to $11 each, the Beru plugs are less expensive but harder to find other than maybe at Neuspeed.

If all plugs were the same price most people would choose to buy the best but this isn't the case, what that tells you is that a person who would put a less than recommended or lower than stck quality part in a car doesn't have the cars best interest in mind, they're decision here is based soley on money.

If one is too cheap or cannot afford the correct parts for a particular vehicle that they plan to buy then they really should choose a different one, one who's proper up keep is within their means.

Anyone who would do such a thing should ask themselves one question: If you had a Ferrari, would you put "H" rate Walmart tires on it?

This is really no different.
 

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TDI Lover
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230 Posts
Too Cold NB1.8T said:

If all plugs were the same price most people would choose to buy the best but this isn't the case, what that tells you is that a person who would put a less than recommended or lower than stck quality part in a car doesn't have the cars best interest in mind, they're decision here is based soley on money.

If one is too cheap or cannot afford the correct parts for a particular vehicle that they plan to buy then they really should choose a different one, one who's proper up keep is within their means.


Amen
 

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MR. VOCHO
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294 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Ok....

I heard that there was a special long tool to get ($30) to get them out from the dealer.....

Or do I only need this :
The tools required for this service will be a 5mm Alan wrench / Hex wrench, and a Spark plug adapter rachet. The spark plug adapter bit for a ratchet set is typically a standard size, but for accuracy purposes the one I used was a 5/8 size adapter. Both are available from your local auto parts store.

Thanx.....

So what spark plugs to get?
 

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Senior Member
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175 Posts
The copper plugs are a colder temperature range and used to help eliminate any chance of detonation especially with a modded turbo beetle. This has nothing to do with a cheaper cost in some cases. It comes OEM with platinum just to have longer periods in between spark plug changes. Just because something costs more doesn't always make it better. Everybody's gonna have a different opinion but most aftermarket forced induction or nitrous cars are recommended to use colder copper plugs.
 

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Premium Member
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4,315 Posts
With a weak single coil electrical system a Platinum or Iridium plug will provide a stronger and more consistant spark.

However if you have a high voltage system with individual coils a copper plug will actually produce the stronger spark. It just takes a lot of juice to get a nice big fat juicy spark out of a copper plug.

The individual coil packs in our bugs provide a ton of juice and make a much better spark with Copper plugs.. the down side is you will need to replace them often vs a weaker but much longer lasting platinum plug.

Manufacturers are encouraged thru competition and the EPA to make tuneups as infrequent as possible so platinum and iridium plugs are very very popular.

I happen to like that longevity and am not having any detonation or pinging so I'm sticking with the exspensive plugs on my buggy but if I was having issues... I would actually got with the el cheapo copper plug. :D
 

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Bourgeoisie
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309 Posts
Also, some tuners recommended copper plugs with higher performance maps, because of what Fowvay just mentioned.
 

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Keep It Real
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1,746 Posts
Fowvay said:
With a weak single coil electrical system a Platinum or Iridium plug will provide a stronger and more consistant spark.

However if you have a high voltage system with individual coils a copper plug will actually produce the stronger spark. It just takes a lot of juice to get a nice big fat juicy spark out of a copper plug.

The individual coil packs in our bugs provide a ton of juice and make a much better spark with Copper plugs.. the down side is you will need to replace them often vs a weaker but much longer lasting platinum plug.

No offense but this information has some holes in it, the Iridium plugs are made of an extremely hard and strong metal with a higher melting point and this allows for a much more durable and effective spark with an electrode that is only 0.4mm in diameter. The design factors that have gone into the Denso Iridium actually decrease energy consumption and increase spark intensity and focus thereby making A/F mixtures smoother and more consistant.

The production of a stronger spark is good but not if the spark plug produces it inconsistantly, with greater energy consumption and without focused intensity like in the case of the typical standard or copper plug.

The ignition system voltage really wasn't an issue even back when domestic muscle cars had a strong presence on the streets with the use of powerful ignition modules and coils from companies like MSD, Accel, Jacobs etc., it certainly isn't a problem with most of todays vehicles which come from the factory equipped with stronger more technologically advanced electrical and ignition systems.

This having been said, for the combination of superior performance, spark intensity, spark focus, spark consistancy and spark plug longevity, you can't beat the Denso Iridium, especially in import high performance and forced induction engines.


Manufacturers are encouraged thru competition and the EPA to make tuneups as infrequent as possible so platinum and iridium plugs are very very popular.

The real reasoning behind manufacturers introducing more and more cars that are made to appear to be lower maintenance is very simple, most people just want to get in a car and drive, they don't want to deal with maintenance issues or anything else for that matter, it's a turn off and a large component in making their choice of which car to purchase.

Bottom line is, the appearance of a lower maintenance vehicle sells cars and this is a car manufacturers primary reason for existing $$$$.


I happen to like that longevity and am not having any detonation or pinging so I'm sticking with the exspensive plugs on my buggy but if I was having issues... I would actually got with the el cheapo copper plug. :D
"If" your car were experiencing detonation problems then that would be even more of a reason not to use "el cheapo copper plug", the sensible direction would be to use a quality set of plugs from the start, use a scan tool for diagnostic assistance, check timing, check both peak and maintained boost levels, A/F ratio etc. until you find the problem.

On more than one occasion, I've seen where standard copper plugs had melted and come apart inside an engine, not pretty.

Using cheap or less than recommended parts is not wise especially in a performance or forced induction engine, to do so can many times involve unnecessary increased risk of failure or engine damage.

Click here>>> http://www.globaldenso.com/PLUG/power/structure.html
 

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Keep It Real
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1,746 Posts
SIX SPEED said:
Ok....

I heard that there was a special long tool to get ($30) to get them out from the dealer.....

Or do I only need this :
The tools required for this service will be a 5mm Alan wrench / Hex wrench, and a Spark plug adapter rachet. The spark plug adapter bit for a ratchet set is typically a standard size, but for accuracy purposes the one I used was a 5/8 size adapter. Both are available from your local auto parts store.

Thanx.....

This should work fine.

So what spark plugs to get?
If your engine has the stock ECU software then stay with the stock plugs or the Denso Iridium, if you are chipped then use the Denso Iridium plugs but one step colder than stock.
 

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Keep It Real
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1,746 Posts
paultakeda said:
Also, some tuners recommended copper plugs with higher performance maps, because of what Fowvay just mentioned.
I've dealt with a lot of tuners and many of the well known ones in this country and other countries over the years and I've "never" seen or heard one recommend copper plugs in an application like this, they are all mostly recommending the stock plug, Denso, Bosch or Beru, not copper.
 

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Senior Member
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175 Posts
As I said everyone will have their own opinion about these kind of things. Every company will have biased research to look superior to the consumer. Denso will claim they are the best. NGK will claim they are the best ect. ect. I have heard first hand stories of people with bad or broken or melted plugs mostly from Denso iridiums and Bosch platinum +4's and so on and so on. Any plug will work more or less the same. Is any one plug that much better than another? Not really. No plug will give you any substantial horpower increase no matter how much you pay for it. I would definately buy a name brand plug however just because the electrode is copper instead of another metal does not make it inferior. It all depends on what application serves you best. On a high performance engine I prefer copper spark plugs but that's just my preference since I change my plugs almost annually.
 

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Keep It Real
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Your welcome to your opinion.
 

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Premium Member
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214 Posts
I've changed my coil packs and spark plugs a few times, and it's no big deal. The fact that the plugs sit down below the coilpacks is sort of a pain in the butt, but I was able to get them in and out without too much hassle. The biggest problem I remember was that the plugs would fall out of my socket wrench, but there's easy fixes for stuff like that.

You just move stuff out of the way and do one plug at a time. No big deal.

Regarding the airfilter - I've had a Beetle for a long time now and I used to spend a lot of time worrying about things like this....as far as I can recall, there's really no "better" filter for your car than the one that comes with it. I never understood the point of using an oiled air filter on a car that spends 99.9% of it's time on paved roads. It's not like we all drive dune buggies or something, and who wants to worry about an oily MAF sensor?
 

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Sloooooooow Down!!!!
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899 Posts
so much i dont know about plugs-i do use the bkr7e they seem to work fine-but i did know by the condition of factory spark plugs that i needed to go step colder since i have a chipped nb.

I read a very interesting article -this guy was so strong that he said platinums and iridum should be banned from all forced induced cars.

This statment may be a little to strong but if you want to read interesting article check this out-i am not agreeing with this article but it is interesting. This one may open up a can of worms.:D

http://forums.audiworld.com/a4gen2/msgs/263262.phtml
 

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Keep It Real
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One might first want to consider that these negative remarks about Iridium plugs come from a person who abuses a K03 turbo by pushing almost 23psi into it, this is about 8psi beyond it's maximum efficiency and recommended "peak boost" pressure.

I have a hard time taking seriously the opinion of someone like this.
 

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Sloooooooow Down!!!!
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899 Posts
I agree too cold.

My stock plugs at 4000 miles were white looking so went to bkr7e -they seem to work well but did check one the other day(had 3000 miles on it) and it was black looking also the inside of exhaust tip is very very black, even throwing black residue on bumper. So i guess it is runninbg too rich.

So i dont know , if this is a problem and needs to be corrected, which plug to use.

I hope the starter of this thread does not mind me bringing up this problem but i believe it is spark plug related and it may help six speed in choice of plugs.
 
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