NewBeetle.org Forums banner

1 - 20 of 27 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Ok so here is the deal. I got a 2001 vw beetle off a guy for 300. The cam chain tensioner guides were worn slam out. That cause the intake cam to bend a few valves. It also caused the cam to score up some journals so I replaced the head. Got it back in, timed and fired it. It immediately started billowing out white smoke. So I'm thinking "ok the turbo is shot.". I ordered a new turbo, installed and fired it up. Ran great for five minutes then white smoke slowly starts lightly puffing out the exhaust. I give it a little gas and she starts billowing clouds of smoke again. I shut it off, check the piston. They are clean. So I fire it up cold again and it's running smooth and clean for about 5 minutes. Then here comes the light smoke. I give it some gas and clouds of smoke start coming out again. Finally I pull the exhaust away from the turbo to see if by chance I got a bad turbo even though it's new. There is no oil on the exhaust turbo flange it's dry. I stick my finger in to see if the wheel is wet. Nope. Where is this thing cooking oil? I just don't get it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,405 Posts
Here are some basics; on the various colors of exhaust smoke and reasons for them:


A couple of things stand out to me; you installed a "used" 1.8T head but did you have it checked out, pressure tested, shaved for flatness and have the valve seals replaced? Have you tested the compression of the engine (rings, blowby,etc); have you done a combustion leak test of the cooling system and this would confirm, the head gasket is good?

A certain amount of smoking, from a repaired engine; is not uncommon, in a car with a blown turbo leaking oil, blown head gasket and this would normally, put allot of oil or coolant residue into the exhaust system and it may have pooled up in the catalytic converter. If the exhaust is heavily contaminated; it may take awhile for the whole system to heat up; burn off the residual build of oil/coolant and finally, stop smoking. How long this would take; I guess it a open question. I recently worked on a 98 Audi A4 1.8T; it had a bad (cracked) turbo and a clogged catalytic converter; it smoked for awhile and then we had to replace the converter, which made the car run better but it did take some time, to burn off the oil contamination of the exhaust/mufflers. So, seeing how; you have had a number of problem which might have contaminated the exhaust and catalytic converter; you might check those and see if they are clogged, heavily contaminated by oil or coolant.

So, you have some work ahead of you; do some testing and do your best, to figure out, if the results of the testing and visual inspections, find everything to be normal. Report back your findings and we can go from there. Thanks.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,405 Posts
PS: do you have a standard or automatic tranmission? Sometimes, the oil can get contaminated from coolant through the oil cooler leaking or the transmission fluid can get coolant mixed in it as well, through the auto trans cooler leaking. Regardless, I would check and confirm; that the crankcase oil looks normal and is not being mixed with coolant, then going out the exhaust. Then, as noted above; the head gasket could be leaking or the valve seals in the head, could be bad.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
Here are som basics; on the various colors of exhaust smoke and reasons for them:


A couple of things stand out to me; you installed a "used" 1.8T head but did you have it checked out, pressure tested, shaved for flatness and have the valve seals replaced? Have you tested the compression of the engine (rings, blowby,etc); have you done a combustion leak test of the cooling system and this would confirm, the head gasket is good?

A certain amount of smoking, from a repaired engine; is not uncommon, in a car with a blown turbo leaking oil, blown head gasket and this would normally, put allot of oil or coolant residue into the exhaust system and it may have pooled up in the catalytic converter. If the exhaust is heavily contaminated; it may take awhile for the whole system to heat up; burn off the residual build of oil/coolant and finally, stop smoking. How long this would take; I guess it a open question. I recently worked on a 98 Audi A4 1.8T; it had a bad (cracked) turbo and a clogged catalytic converter; it smoked for awhile and then we had to replace the converter, which made the car run better but it did take some time, to burn off the oil contamination of the exhaust/mufflers. So, seeing how; you have had a number of problem which might have contaminated the exhaust and catalytic converter; you might check those and see if they are clogged, heavily contaminated by oil or coolant.

So, you have some work ahead of you; do some testing and do your best, to figure out, if the results of the testing and visual inspections, find everything to be normal. Report back your findings and we can go from there. Thanks.
This great. I did have the head resurfaced, new cam seals, valves re seated and washed in aluminum cleaner by a very reputable machine shop. There is a lot of.oil in the exhaust and I thought the same thing. Maybe I will drop the system and clean it/replace it if necessary. I do keep getting a code for MAF but it is a new MAF so I'm not sure about that yet. I did a cimpression teat if the engine and all is well there. Not sure about the coolant ayatemtemperature teat. Will have to look into that too. Thanks for all the good advice. I will keep you posted.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
PS: do you have a standard or automatic tranmission? Sometimes, the oil can get contaminated from coolant through the oil cooler leaking or the transmission fluid can get coolant mixed in it as well, through the auto trans cooler leaking. Regardless, I would check and confirm; that the crankcase oil looks normal and is not being mixed with coolant, then going out the exhaust. Then, as noted above; the head gasket could be leaking or the valve seals in the head, could be bad.
No water in the oil if that is what you mean and I don't see a leak in the head gasket anywhere.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,405 Posts
Please post, any trouble codes you are getting; it sounds like you have done your due diligence and made a extra effort, to have the head rebuilt and your compression test came out ok (what were the psi numbers)? If everything is working ok; the install went as it should and your new turbo is fine, then, I can only assume oil/coolant residue is in the exhaust system? The customer on the Audi A4 with the 1.8T; I think, said it took a number of days, driving around, to finally get the smoke under control? Keep us in the loop and tell us about anything you figure out. Thanks.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Please post, any trouble codes you are getting; it sounds like you have done your due diligence and made a extra effort, to have the head rebuilt and your compression test came out ok (what were the psi numbers)? If everything is working ok; the install went as it should and your new turbo is fine, then, I can only assume oil/coolant residue is in the exhaust system? The customer on the Audi A4 with the 1.8T; I think, said it took a number of days, driving around, to finally get the smoke under control? Keep us in the loop and tell us about anything you figure out. Thanks.
The only code was p0102. The PSI READINGS are 161 142 171 174.
Thanks for the rely
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,405 Posts

For the maf sensor, you might hook up a scan tool, read live data from he maf pid and wiggle the plug, wiring to see if the signal drops out (indicating a wiring issue; possibly replace loose terminal ends or the plug might be be damaged, not securely locking as it should).

If you end up needing a new plug, terminal ends; you can buy them @ your local vw dealer or buy a plug/pigtail combo on amazon or ebay. For a important sensor like the MAF; i would prefer the high quality parts from vw; compared to the cheaper Chinese plug/pigtail aftermarket parts online but that is up to you.


You could log the maf reading with something like vcds by ross tech or have a passenger observe things as you max out the maf capability by driving in 2nd gear @ WOT.


If you need ti replace the maf; stick with oem Bosch sensors and do NOT buy a cheaper aftermarket part, as Bosch uses a patented thin film sensor, others don't use and thus cannot read correctly.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,405 Posts
Compression specs:

New: 10-14 bar (145-203 psi)

Wear limit: 7 bar (101 psi)

Permissible difference between all cylinders:

3 bar (43 psi)

The second cylinder is at the low end if the compression spec; makes one winder, why it is so low but it is still above the 101 psi wear limit (32 psi difference from the highest compression reading).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #10
I ordered a new catalytic converter. It will he in tomorrow. I will install it this weekend and see of that stops the oil cooking. If not then I guess it's down to a combustion leak test. I will keep you posted
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,405 Posts
Makes sense, in the case of the Audi A4 i was working on; the catalytic converter was actually plugged up and that is why we replaced it (not just from oil contamination).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
Update: got the new cat in. She isn't smoking anymore so that's a win. Now I'm getting the oil light flashing when I rev it up though. I looked down in the oil filler and it's pumping oil up to the cams. The levels are right too. I just changed the oil and checked for leaks no leaks and it's not burning any so I don't really know where to go from here. maybe it's because it's not level. I've got it up on jack stands in the front right now. Also. I let it run for ten minutes and the fans never kicked in. I'm concerned that they may not be working. Any thoughts?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Also, when I pulled out the cat I found the rest of the turbo in it. Kind of neat to see an entire sprocket sitting down in there.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,405 Posts
Well, good news; on the elimination of the smoking! :) Was the catalytic converter clogged up; by the way? That is crazy; the "spit out" turbo parts were in there?

As for the oil pressure light; you need to confirm, it is in spec with a oil pressure test kit. Once, that is confirmed and good or bad, you can move on to the next needed steps or repairs.


Don't get discouraged; major failures and repairs, typically require, a number of troubleshooting sessions and ongoing checks, to fully work all the "bugs" out of a poorly neglected 1.8T.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
13 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Last question. What oil do you guys use in these engines? Weight/brand/synthetic or conventional? I think I'm gonna drop the pan and check the pick up. Just because it's got a lot of miles on it and when I pulled the valve cover on the old head the cam chain tensioner guide railed were eaten up pretty badly and there were chunks in the head. Probably have some in the pan too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,405 Posts
For oil, 100% synthetic is recommended; pick a brand and look online, at their "oil selector" type search areas, you would want to follow those results and those would meet the needed vw spec (e.g. VW 502 00/505 00)
etc).

For example, Mobil 1; comes up with Mobil 1™ FS 0W-40, typically available at most auto parts stores and places like Walmart. I use Amsoil, as my brother is a dealer and am very happy with it.


Pick your favorite brand oil and use their recommendations; that meet VW's specs and go from there.

As to the pulling of the oil pan and checking/replacing the oil pickup tube, that would be typical for a high mileage 1.8T. However, before tearing things apart; I would do the oil pressure test and that way, you can confirm things, do a "before/after" test, to make sure, you are ok. You defintiely, don't want to risk; damaging you new rebuilt head and turbocharger. You will need to pull the sending unit; to be able to hook up the oil pressure gauge. You will typically, need a thread adapter; to hook up the oil pressure tester correctly but some of the better testers, may include it in the kit.

I got mine from Autozone; special order and wasn't that expensive (came next day).

sunpro metric adapter kit part #: cp7573 (it comes with a number of adapters; the one for the 1.8T is: M10 X 1.0 to 1/8" NPT,)

https://www.google.com/search?q=sunpro+metric+adapter+kit+part+#:+cp7573&oq=sunpro+metric+adapter+kit+part+#:+cp7573&aqs=chrome.0.69i57&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#bav=on.2,or.r_qf.&ei=buUHUqefOqaSyAGz_YDQDQ&fp=8201f174c44bfa5e&q=sunpro+metric+adapter+kit+part+#:+cp7573&sa=X&tbm=shop&ved=0CDoQsxg

Also, these oil pans, do not use a gasket but a special sealer:

  • Oil Pan Gasket Sealer, D176404A2 (Victor Reinz)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,405 Posts
As for the cooling system, it maybe a case; that the system, has not fully burped yet and you still have air in the block? Purging the system, can be a challenge; the service manual, recommends the use of a vacuum filler tool and this quickly elminates, any air pockets. I struggled with this issue; so, I bought the UView Airlift tool and it works very well. You can get the air out without a tool but it may take some time, effort for it to come out.

Here is a video; showing blocking the return line and grasping the cooling hose to the thermostat, to help the bleeding process: (confirm, the return line to the coolant tank; is NOT clogged or it will be very hard to burp the system).


different engine but principles are the same:


As noted in the last video; you need to monitor the coolant temps and that way, you can observe when the fans should kick on. Here is a great thread; discussing, checking fan operation and confirming, everything is working as it should:

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,405 Posts
Lastly, because, you have a 1.8T, the turbocharger failed and you have a expensive NEW turbocharger assembly, I would highly recommend, you check or replace the auxiliary waterpump. Many times, these stop working, leak or get really noisy; when they wear out or are about to die. This pump runs, when the engine is turned off; for awhile, to cool down the turbo and prevent, overheating, coking up, of the oil lube galleys, premature failure.

More info here: (located on the passenger side of the radiator):

 
1 - 20 of 27 Posts
Top